I put Vista Beta 2 on my laptop and we were talking about it at Tom's Hardware Forums

Everyone was pretty pumped on how it looked, me especially. That was until someone came in an posted that there are 2 different flavors of Vista. A cut down version for $99 and the "real" version for $499! So your question, "Will Vista increase demand for skinning?" I think is a definate, Yes. I searched the net and found a comperable skin and posted a link at Tom's. Seems a whole heck of a lot cheaper than going with a whole new OS.

Microstiff crys so much about piracy, but they don't look at why it's getting pirated, instead they raise the price, and crank up the security... that will help. Even now the Windows Genuine Advantage tool checks your copy of Windows then phones home w/o your permission and sends your personal info to MS. I would rather stay with the "Devil I know" and skin XP Pro than go with Vista and probably get caught in some new MS license scam in the next couple of years when it is too late to turn back. MS will turn out to be their own worst enemy. I for one can't see spending $499 on an OS when I can have the same look from a talented skinner and buy a PS3 with what I save!

Skinners will always skin. General users will not. I know lots of people that see my fully tricked out desltops and Oooo and Ahhh, but don't want to change anything on thier PCs because PCs make them nervous enough as it is and they don't want to step away from out-of-the-box. {that sentence is way too long . . . I need an editor]   

The less the sheeple skin, the cooler I appear, let's stick with that then. 

I am new to this forum. How do I check out your stuff? Is there a link I can see what skins you have posted?

I will be honest with you. I used Window Blinds in the past. I don't know how long ago. I felt like my system performance went down. I am probably crazy, but that's what my feeling was. Now that we have dual core everything, we have power to burn. I don't think I will feel like a skin is bringing a 2.16 Ghz dual core to it's knees   

I installed WB today and I am seriously looking at the Vista type skins. I would like to offer these on my notebooks I sell as an option. I am envisioning it like this.

Customer buys a notebook. Checks off the skin option of lets say Royle Vista or something, it adds on the cost of WB and I install it for them with the OS install.
My question to anyone who knows, are these skins just free? Do the skinners just do it because they're cool or what? If that is the case they all get an A+ in my COOL BOOK.

I am new to this forum. How do I check out your stuff? Is there a link I can see what skins you have posted?

Click on the name of the poster (the one who posted) and then click on the link to show skins. {Please note, mine suck }

I would like to offer these on my notebooks I sell as an option. I am envisioning it like this.

https://www.stardock.com/products/thememanageroem/

Contact [email protected] for licensing options on other corporate solutions.

If you are charging to buy WB, and install the skin, plus labor it'd d be cool to kick a little something back to the artist.

Thanks for the info, I think kickin something back tot he artist is more than fair.

Starkers: DesktopX works on Vista allready.

Yeah, I read that someplace just before....will be trying it out shortly.

Here is my problem.
The skin looks awesome.
I have a AMD X2 4400+ with 4 gigs of RAm
6800 GS 256 MB

I have tried every resolution imaginable and I can't get WindowBlinds to work to a level that I would say, "properly". It loads, grinds the system to a halt, won't display the graphics properly, everything is slowed to a crawl and I just have to turn it off before I go nuts. What am I doing wrong?

KillerNotebooks: The current version of WindowBlinds is not designed to work on Vista. Probably explains why yours grinds to a halt 

will be trying it out shortly.

Nope....no good!! DX installs okay, and it'll load objects and widgets, but not themes. Have tried various ways and even uninstalling, reinstalling, but DX keeps crashing each time a theme file is clicked on. Oh well, it'll have to wait...haven't had enough sleep over the last 48 hours to feel inclined, motivated enough to try fix it now.

That's just it. I am running XP Media Center (crap) and want to make it visually like Vista (or something like it).

I should also say I have a 24" LCD running at 1920 x 1200. I tried turning the resolution down thinking the skins may be designed for specific res, and it helps a little. What the heck am I doing wrong?

I've been running Windows Vista Beta 2 for about 3 weeks now and have really enjoyed the default skin. But as many here have already said, if you are into customization you will be modding your GUI regardless.

In answer to your question on whether or not the release of Vista will generate more skinning interest all depends on the ability to make use of Vista's 3d desktop. As it stands I think the Aero theme is really just "OK" and nothing more. Its clean but really nothing special in my opinion. I don't run the Aero ports on my XP machine, mainly because they lack what really makes true Vista Aero good: refraction. The only reason the transparency works on Vista is because the light "refracts" so your background is blurred. Straight transparency without refraction is very distracting and makes it difficult to tell which window is on top, even with a decent opacity level.

If Stardock can offer a way to allow skinners to incorparate things like refraction and reflection then the answer is YES, you can increase the skinning demand by creating very unique interfaces.

That's just it. I am running XP Media Center

ATI driver? Google for "windowblinds media center" (without quotes). First hit.

Will Vista increase the demand for skinning?

I believe yes. But we may have to rethink "skinning". The new .Net3.0, with its separation of design and behavior logic, is by its very design meant to be not only customizable, but more accessible to both designers and coders.

XAML, the XML based language that the new .Net3.0 apps use to define their GUI, is mind-bogglingly powerful, yet simple enough to read and know what is being described. That is, if designers feel the need to write XAML by hand at all when they can just use Expression Interactive Designer to make it WYSIWYG for them.

I've been making a list display in DesktopX recently. I can modify on the standard forms list control only a few things, font, line height, background, foreground, selected colors. A XAML list control has no limits to what could be "customized". The list elements could be buttons...animated buttons, sets of other organized controls, animated text...you name it.

What I'm saying is, Vista is a skinner's paradise when it comes to designing application GUIs and hopefully support (for XAML) will come for the gadgets and such.

That support may not be needed though. The Vista sidebar and gadgets do seem lackluster. They should; Stardock, et al, have been making them for years. But with design and logic separated, and free (for the time being) tools for making them, I would not be surprised to see many skinners begin to develop their own, specialized applications.

RSS gadgets, for example, always seem underpowered, a bit of a pain to configure, and in general more effort than they are worth (to me). But if a skinner decided to sit down and use XAML / C# to make the best damn RSS reader out there, it could still be as stylish and unobtrusive as the sleekest gadget. And it could, theoretically, be easily skinnable by anyone who wanted to create their own XAML.

We could see a return to the days of BeatNik for your clock, Rainlender for your calendar, SysMetrix for your meters type specialization. Where powerful, self contained, specialized, skinnable apps flourish.

Nope....no good!! DX installs okay, and it'll load objects and widgets, but not themes. Have tried various ways and even uninstalling, reinstalling, but DX keeps crashing each time a theme file is clicked on. Oh well, it'll have to wait...haven't had enough sleep over the last 48 hours to feel inclined, motivated enough to try fix it now.

Oh, I haven't tried applying themes. I was only playing around with objects, widgets and gadgets.

Oh, I haven't tried applying themes. I was only playing around with objects, widgets and gadgets.

Well for the time being, DX themes cannot be applied in Vista, according to a windows report I got at next startup....bugger, should've thought to kept it to copy & paste here.

Anyway, it listed a number of compatability issues (files names that made no sense to me) and suggested I check back at a later date for solutions, which I shall do, posting the results here as I'll still be none the wiser for all that code and tech speak which goes completely over the top of my head. The thing is, I have XP pro as my main OS and can live without customising Vista (only for a short while ), so I'll just be patient and wait for the programmers here to get 'em working happily together.